Receiver or Preamp?

[Jimmy Lindgren]

Hello,

Now to the next interesting question. What are your thoughts, do you already have a preamp/power amp,if so did they make such a big difference or did you just become poorer.

Those of you who have a receiver are you now considering switching to pre/power amp or are you satisfied? Your thoughts about this.

Own a Marantz receiver myself, only had the opportunity to try pairing it with emotive xpa 3 and xtz edge a-300. However, I ended up going back to just the Marantzen. What do you think, is the next step preamp+power amp or is a receiver sufficient?

 

[Luis Vazquez]

Changing to separates would be a tough decision for me right now… my previous system was in a different house in a large living room that was open to the dining room and hallway.  I had an Emotiva XMC-1, XPA-2 and XPA-5 amplifiers; both Gen 2, so they were extremely heavy due to the large toroidal transformers.  LCR were DIYSG speakers with two DIY 18″ subwoofers in sealed enclosures powered by two Crown 2502 amps; dynamically it was a beast, but it had to pressurize a lot of space.  My current system is in a much smaller and dedicated room; it is built around a Marantz Cinema 50.  So far I don’t miss the Emotiva electronics as I really like what I’m hearing from the Marantz; however, I’m in a much smaller room with doors; therefore, far less air space to pressurize.  I am currently considering a second 1961 1v subwoofer to even out the bass across seats; however, not sure I miss the extra power from separate amps as the Marantz has been pushing the 1961 speakers very well.  It’s certainly an option for me down the road as the Cinema 50 has preamp outputs, so for example, I can always purchase a 3 channel amp for the LCR and let the Marantz power the rest; however, right now, not sure I need the extra power, extra cables, extra space requirements… I like the simplicity and sound I’m getting from the Marantz…

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[Luis Vazquez]

Sorry for the double post, but I forgot to ask a question… you indicated you added an Emotiva XPA-3 and XTZ Edge A-300, yet went back to just the Marantz… why did you switch back?  Curious to understand what you felt those amps added, that you didn’t like or did you feel there was no improvement in sound; therefore, the added expense wasn’t justified?

[Jimmy Lindgren]

Very interesting, thanks for the reply!
For about 2 years I had a Marantz SR7012 with the Sonus Faber veneer 3.0 series. After reading very well about the XTZ Edge A-300 plus that it was quite cheap, I bought one to try out with frontspeakers.
Played with the XTZ together with the Marantzen for a while then after a week or so I only tried the Marantzen and didn’t feel like I noticed that much of a difference. So I send the XTZ back to the dealer. Then last Christmas I bought the Anthem MRX740, was really happy with how it played but couldn’t stand the terrible fan noise coming from my Anthem so I returned it and exchanged it for the Marantz SR7015 that I have now + an Emotiva XPA . Tried it back and forth. Had other friends here with the same interest in sound but none of us could hear any difference with or without Emotiva so it went back to the dealer :) Now I only drive the Marantzen but am thinking about a pre amp. But haven’t decided yet if it’s worth the money.

[Luis Vazquez]

It might not matter, but I forgot to ask, did you rerun Audyssey after you added the amps?

Generally speaking, in my opinion, an external amp, shouldn’t impart any sonic differences into the audio chain, it should be transparent and simply allow the signal to flow through the system… I believe this is what you and your friends experienced and concluded.

That being said, besides a higher / more consistent power rating for all channels driven, an external amp should also have more reserve power; therefore, dynamically it should allow your system to swing effortlessly between a quiet to blockbuster type scene without strain or sounding harsh… this might be harder to test / validate.

I’m speaking in very general terms… but room size and listening habits will also play important roles in formulating a decision between separate processor and amps vs an AVR vs adding a separate amp to an AVR.  I think it comes down to preferences and your ultimate goal… for now, I’m satisfied with my Cinema 50 AVR.

[Lukas]

Luis explained it already very well. It always will depend on your room and listening habits.

I was fortunate enough to be able to test even the most expensive gear on the market and I quickly realized that differences are extremely small. Especially with amps.

At my old job, I did gain matched blind tests and basically, no one could hear a difference. I am not saying there aren’t any, but they are much smaller. Half of a db difference in gain sometimes made a much bigger impact.

But you guys did the right thing, try it for yourself, only that matters. If you feel there is a difference and it is worth your hard-earned money, then there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

I use a Yamaha Pre-Amp and inexpensive PA style amps with Pascal Class D modules. Very happy with it, but I was also thinking of switching to an AVR only.

 

 

[arkmann]

I upgraded from a Denon AVR with 130 watts @ 8 ohms to Rotel amp and preamp with 200 watts @ 8 ohms as I moved from a 7 speaker speaker setup with 300 watt powered subwoofers in the L and R front speakers for music and video to a 2 speaker setup for mainly music with 1723 S towers.  Listen to music streaming hi res songs from Qobuz through a Bluenode node DAC and also some CDs.  The sonic benefits are more dynamic range including bass with more thump but not distorted or muddy.  The extra power definitely made a difference. Allowed for Balanced inputs with XLR cables instead of RCA plugs or optical cables from the CD player.  Sounds better and Looks good too.  Like to play classic rock loud.  Yes it cost more money but was on my wishlist to upgrade my equipment for a long time and for me it was worth the investment.  Love what I hear more than ever and love what I see when I look at the equipment when listening.

[CY]

I decided on the more affordable processor+amp route, Tonewinner AT-300 and 2 units of Tonewinner AD-7300PA (190W @ 8ohm all channel driven).

I have listened to a similar 1961 set-up with an AVR, the standalone amps really brings out the speakers performance IMO. And with the processor, everything seems further apart rather than in your face kinda sound.

[brian-w]

This is always the big decision and one that needs to be made upfront pretty quickly for a theater. Theater is the core of what I did. I did not have the money to buy (and still don’t) the processor that I want. So I bought a Denon 6700. I used the internal amps for the 11 channel set up. My room is on the large side and I sit 13-14 feet from the speakers, the Denon has a nice sound, very nice sound actually, but fell short for my theater application. I wanted more power to fill the space and the preamp outs on the Denon are fantastic. So I added an outlaw 7000x to drive the bed layer. I did get a little more dB, but… to my ears the internal Denon amps were more relaxing to listen to, so I stuck the outlaw in the atmos and let the Denon drive the base layer 7. I then added a parasound a52+… I think you can see where this is going… then I added a parasound a31. So I went with receiver knowing I would go full preout overtime. I have one more amp to purchase, a JC5 for the front L and R, then I can save up for my storm audio or trinnov. To my ears the class A for the first hand full of watts it magic with music. I tested the McIntosh as well, but decided to keep the parasound. So my answer, both a receiver then processor… but I’m saving up for that processor! I’ll start scratching lotto tickets soon!

[Jimmy Lindgren]

Hi Brian,

 

thanks for the reply.

I this hobby you can always try something new and thats whats fun with it.

My end goal is just like yours whit a pre amp setup. I bought a 8ch power amp this week and changed my SR7015 to preamp mode. And got really happy with the result.

Maybe we Arendals people should start a thread and get to getter and buy a eurojackpot :)

[Lukas]

Hey Brian,

As someone who did some comparison with those uber-expensive processors, don’t expect them to be much better than a midrange AV-preamp.
They are great when you have a more complex system with different signal routing, which is unique to Trinnov and co.
But other than that a good Athem PrePro will easily keep up in terms of sound quality.

One of my best friends has the Trinnov Alt 32 and extremely high-end speakers. The more you correct the signal the worse it sounds. It is no magic box that does everything.